Talk:Apocalypse Now

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wording

In the plot section I don't see the need for "borne" in "helicopter-borne air assault". Leaving it out conveys the same thing. 2600:387:1:811:0:0:0:4C (talk) 04:22, 24 October 2021 (UTC) -- The previous IP is -- Otr500 (talk) 04:50, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

Revised. Mztourist (talk) 04:42, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

• Thank you, Also: Wikipedia IP police; NOTICE': The above IP signed content was Added while inadvertently signed out on mobile. ----PLEASE DO NOT global IP block me. Until the mobile version has a sign-in, sign-out, and an edit page box I will not edit on mobile again. ---- Again, PLEASE -- PLEASE --- do not global block me for an accident. Just to make sure, considering the crap I have gone through with an IP block and a global block ---- PLEASE DO NOT BLOCK MY ACCOUNT BECAUSE I WAS NOT LOGGED IN ON MOBIL. I hope that will suffice but probably not. -- Otr500 (talk) 04:50, 24 October 2021 (UTC)
• :One day in the future, when I become trustworthy enough, I hope to obtain IP block exemption. I am not sure the criteria because I was already assured I could but --- Anyway, I think I may have made a mobile edit before while not signed in. I have never received a reply (so don't actually know) but the second was complicated and took too long. That could have been the reason for at least the second block (IP global but both were removed). I have otherwise never had a block. -- Otr500 (talk) 05:00, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/historis — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aries Tripu Trianto (talk • contribs) 08:14, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

Harrison Ford in Infobox

User:Wrath X Template:Infobox film states "In general, use the billing block of the poster or the film's original theatrical release as a rule of thumb for listing starring actors." "In general" doesn't mean that Harrison Ford cannot be listed. Given Ford's fame it would be highly unusual not to list him in the Infobox, particularly as he is mentioned on the page. Mztourist (talk) 10:10, 15 May 2023 (UTC)

What reason is there to list Ford? His role is minor and the official billing block omits him. If we listed him purely for his fame then by that logic we can list actors who simply had cameos in other films because they're famous. Daniel Craig cameoed in Star Wars: The Force Awakens, Michael Caine had a voice cameo in Dunkirk; if we applied your logic then these actors should be listed since they are pretty famous.

Not to mention, fame is subjective. Just how famous should an actor be for them to warrant a place in the infobox? I can imagine this question leading to edit wars. The billing block contains the list of actors the studio has decided to officially advertise for its film and is therefore the closest thing to an objective listing.

Template:Infobox film does say "in general". But this is because not every film uses a billing block on its poster for its cast (The Warriors); alternatively the theatrical poster billing block may not fully match the Blu-ray/DVD billing block (Ant-Man).

I will point out that Apocalypse Now Redux has its own article/infobox and it does list Ford and other actors in its billing block, so Ford should be listed there. -- Wrath X (talk) 11:13, 15 May 2023 (UTC)

So if he's listed on the Redux Infobox, why is he not listed here? Unlike Craig (concealed in armor) and Caine (voiceover) Ford actually appeared onscreen for about 10 minutes, he had several lines and his nametag/character was an early easter egg/trolling of George Lucas. You can't seriously dispute that Harrison Ford is famous? "In general" means its guidance, not policy. Mztourist (talk) 03:12, 16 May 2023 (UTC)

Of course Ford is famous, the point is if we added people simply for being famous it will lead to edit wars. Just how famous should an actor need to be to be listed? Must they be "blockbuster famous" (well known even to casual viewers) or is fame among cinephiles enough? How would we measure this? One could argue that R. Lee Ermey should also be listed in the infobox as he's famous (especially for starring in another war film) while someone can argue that he shouldn't as he's not "blockbuster famous" and wasn't even famous at the time. This is what I mean by subjective.

Furthermore, listing actors (and staff) by fame and not by importance is misleading. Should we list Stan Lee as actor and producer in the infoboxes of all the Marvel films he appeared in and technically executive-produced because he's famous? This would be misleading, it would give the reader the impression that he did actual significant producing work and his role was important. We can mention Lee in the article but not infobox. The infobox is to summarize information to the reader; for more detailed information the reader goes to the article. Even importance itself is subjective. Editors can argue over how much screen time an actor would need to warrant a place in the infobox.

Ford is listed in Redux's infobox as he is officially listed in its casting billing block. The billing block is not a perfect solution. But these are the actors the film/studio has officially listed. The billing block is the closest thing to an objective listing.

If you feel strongly about this, I suggest you start this discussion in Template talk:Infobox film as this pertains to film infoboxes in general. -- Wrath X (talk) 07:15, 16 May 2023 (UTC)

Ride of the Valkyries and Military

The helicopter attack scene with the Ride of the Valkyries has its historical model in the Die Deutsche Wochenschau of June 4, 1941 (from minute 12:30), in which the air landing of the Germans on Crete was highlighted with the same piece. See and hear here: https://archive.org/details/1941-06-04-Die-Deutsche-Wochenschau-561 My English is too bad, so an English speaking author can put this in the article.--Mike Ax (talk) 13:06, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

Very interesting, thank you for sharing that.The problem we would face is in directly connecting that to Apocalypse Now as the work the inspiration derived from. The Ride of the Valkyries was used in film long before Die Deutsche Wochenschau - in The Birth of a Nation. So, absent a specific statement from Francis Ford Coppola that the former was the inspiration, rather than the latter, we'd be engaging in original research. The only reference I ran across that discussed this - https://flypaper.soundfly.com/discover/how-apocalypse-now-etched-wagners-ride-valkyries-into-our-brains/ - was regarding the efforts to use Sir Georg Solti's version, as stated by editor Walter Murch. However, I did not intensely or deeply research beyond that. If you can find a source that confirms a direct connection, then it could be added. cheers. anastrophe, an editor he is. 20:17, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello Anastrophe, thanks for the information, this music was used so early in the film. Greetings Mike Ax Mike Ax (talk) 18:02, 13 June 2023 (UTC)

(This affords me one of the very rare opportunities to humble brag that I worked on Apocalypse Now, in the most trivial way - I sat and monitored the recording machines at Skywalker Sound while Mr. Murch was remixing AN for the laserdisc release - so long ago!) cheers. anastrophe, an editor he is. 20:22, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

Charlie

The phrase "Charlie don't surf" needs explanation. It's been almost 50 years since I saw the film, so I can't be 100% sure which group "charlie" refers to. (South) Vietnamese? Viet-Cong? North Vietnamese Army Regulars? I also note that the line is stereotyping and may be (mildly) offensive (today) - I really don't know. The line is notable enough to warrant explanation, I'd say. Since some American soldiers surfed during the Vietnam War, it is possible (or even likely) that both Vietnamese civilians and possibly even Viet Cong (of a certain age) did surf as well, just speculation but copy-catting is human nature.40.142.183.146 (talk) 22:09, 7 July 2023 (UTC)